PC Minutes 1980-10-21ARROYO GRANDE PLANNING COMMISSION
October 21, 1980
The Arroyo Grande Planning Commission met in regular session with Chairman
Gorsline presiding. Present are Commissioners Cole, Fischer, Gerrish, Pilkington
and Sebastian. Commissioner Moots is absent. Planning Director. Castro is also in
attendance.
MINUTE APPROVAL
Upon hearing no . corrections, additions or deletions, the minutes of the regu-
lar meeting of September 16, 1980 were approved on motion by Commissioner Cole,
seconded by Commissioner Pilkington, and unanimously carried.
ELECTION OF OFFICERS FOR 1980 -81
Chairman Gorsline advised that this item would be continued to the next meet-
ing when, hopefully, all Commissioners will be present.
REQUEST FOR EXTENSION - TENTATIVE MAP TRACT NO. 761, RANCHO GRANDE PROPERTIES
Planning Director Castro read a letter from Rancho Grande Properties, dated
October 3, 1980, stating that it is their understanding that they had not been
granted the full amount of time to record their first final map for Tract 761 as
permitted under the State Subdivision Map Act. Mr. Castro pointed out that on
January 15, 1980, the Commission had granted an extension, but had used the wrong
date, in that the Council's final action on Tract No. 761 was made on June 12, 1979
and, according to the Ordinance, the first tentative map approval consists of 18
months, and the Commission then has the ability to grant an extension of 12.months.
Mr. Castro stated that he has discussed the matter with the City Attorney and City
Engineer, and they are in agreement that an extension to December 12, 1981 would
be appropriate.
After a brief discussion, on motion by Commissioner Fischer, seconded by Com-
missioner Pilkington, and unanimously carried, granting an extension to December
12, 1981 on Tentative Map Tract No. 761, Rancho Grande.
PUBLIC HEARING - CONTINUATION. OF REZONING CASE NO. 80 -143, PROPERTY LYING GENERALLY
EASTERLY OF PILGRIM WAY AND THE ARROYO GRANDE HIGH SCHOOL PROPERTY, NORTHEASTERLY OF
VALLEY ROAD, AND ABUTTING HIGHWAY 101 TO THE EASTERLY PROPERTY LINE. ZONE CHANGE
FROM "A" DISTRICT TO "P -D" DISTRICT - GRANDE HIGHLANDS. (BUSICK - GEARING).
Planning Director Castro reminded the Commission that the matter .of the public
hearing was closed at the ,:last regular meeting. He noted that the report prepared
by the City Engineer regarding water supplies was previously mailed to the Commis-
sion. With regard to that report, Mr. Castro pointed out that the Council had accep-
ted it with the nine recommendations as current policies of the City. Mr. Castro
briefly reviewed the computations of dwelling units contained in the report as being
the existing and potential number of dwelling units, and also that agricultural
lands have been included in the total numbers.
With .regard to Grande Highlands, Mr. Castro advised that a total of 183 dwell-
ing units would be the top number of units that the City would consider and, de- -
pending on the final plans, .there could be less. With regard to drainage, Mr.. Castro
pointed out that the Commission had agreed on the resolution of the problem through
the ponding method. On the circulation, Mr. Castro advised he would have to agree
with City Engineer Karp that, in looking at the current road patterns in the area,
opening of some additional streets would be essential.
Commissioner Sebastian referred to Mr. Karp's report on the water supply and
quality. With regard to the projected number of dwelling units, Commissioner Sebastian
pointed out that lot splits, zone changes, and changing from low densities to high
densities were not taken into consideration in these predictions and already we have.
a gallon a minute deficit. Simple arithmetic would indicate that this City will
have a 1994. deficit, assuming that the current rate of population increases only at •
the rate of 3 to 327. per annum. We have right now approved densities that will cer-
tainly double our population within that . time if all of the projects get with it.
This deficit should be considered greater since good water works practices would dic-
tate that a purveyor should be capable of producing water to meet peak day demands with
at least one well out of service. He further commented that the Engineer has recom-
mended construction of the first well within the next few years. He stated he wonders
what "the next few years" means. .
With respect to the discussion in the report regarding the quality of water, he
pointed out,that we didn't have proper.water quality before the construction of Lopez,
and now we have already started, without having our new units built out, experiencing
water quality problems. Commissioner Sebastian stated that the solution to the nitrate
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Arroyo Grande Planning Commission, 10 -21 -80
Page 2
problem is blending with water of a better quality, and the City does not now have
the physical plant to blend this water. He stated that one of the things that con-
cerns him is that the City Council, last week, overrode the Commission's recommend-
ation and are annexing property, 12 acres, and the people are talking about approxi-
mately 40 to 45 units being built on that, and we have one project with 15 units in
front of us and, frankly, what we don't have right now is a reliable source to take
care of the things that we have already approved. Mr. Sebastian made.reference to
the year 1976 when Lopez dropped 22 feet off the top and commented he wondered how
we would have faired that year if we had been built out to what we have already ap-
proved. He stated he didn't think Lopez would have handled it especially since we
share that water with other people. He further stated that he would like the Com-
mission, as a group, to be able to really look at this thing, and he is not too
excited about rushing through things and annexing property and approving large par-
cels until we get our supply to handle what we have got and what we have already ap-
proved. Commissioner Sebastian pointed out that none of his previous comments have
anything to do with Grande Highlands' plan; they have to do with "where are
we going and when are we going to take the responsibility ?"
Planning Director Castro stated that with regard to Commissioner Sebastian's
comments about lot splits, these were taken into consideration in the total number
of d.u.'s and as to zone changes, that is an unpredictable item.
Commissioner Sebastian stated with regard to the applicant's calculations for
the holding ponds, one of the things that we have been doing is taking all of our
roof water and all of our pavement water and shoving it down the storm drains and
into the Arroyo Grande Creek down to the ocean; and before we started building this
City we had high level ground water and all of that water was going into this aqui-
fier. This aquifier is presently being depleted at the rate of.800 acre feet per
annum. What we are doing now is depleting our own ground water system, which the
City is now going to have to go after to be able to blend some water.
Commissioner Cole stated she feels that water is a problem that we deal with
constantly, and we are very typical in that we know that we have a,.problem, but we
don't face it until it becomes a critical one. Whether we approved any more build -.
ing in the City of Arroyo Grande, the people here are going to have to face the
water problem and what we are doing right here is not going to affect it; it just
means that it is going to push it a little bit faster, because the problem is here
and it was here yesterday; it isn't just developing right now. She further stated
that Arroyo Grande is not the only community that has problems with nitrate infil-
trations, etc., and we are going to have to face a large water project. She stated
she can go• along with what Commissioner Sebastian is saying but, in her opinion, we
shouldn't stop just because we have a water . problem; and we have to face the water
problem along with what we are doing, because we do not stop growing, we do not stop
having children, and we cannot stop growing in Arroyo Grande. Commissioner Pilkington
commented that as long as we keep going, we will keep compounding the water problem
and make it come on even faster. Commissioner Fischer stated, in her opinion, it
will be more difficult to get a multi billion dollar project approved by the voters
for water when the City is annexing more property by saying, that water is not a miti-
gating factor in accepting development.
With regard to the requested zone change from the "A" District to the "P -D"
District, Commissioner Sebastian stated he feels that this particular plan is unimag-
inative, and it looks like another "put some condominiums and duplexes in here and
there and on the higher elevations break up into some one acre lots and let it go at
that ". And if this is truly going to be our outer limits then he feels that Possi-
bly we should look at this land as no more dense than the current "R -S" zoning. He
stated he feels that zoning would be more appropriate on the outskirts of our com-
munity and, in his, opinion, would be a lot more pleasing aesthetically to the people
in Arroyo Grande who are going to have to look at it. He stated his feelings are
that he doesn't necessarily see us going into a "P -D "; and a good alternative would
be the "R -S" zoning; he feels it would be.better planning, and normally when you
enter a coiiu«unity, you enter a less dense situation. Considering the visual impact
of this particular development and the concerns we have with regard to our future
water until we get ready, in his opinion, the . possibility of the "R -S" zoning at 21
acres might be more compatible with what the County is doing on the land adjacent . to
it. He further stated he could not support this particular conceptual• : plan as it is
shown at this time.
In answer to Commissioner Gerrish's question as to how many times this parti-
cular plan has been before the Commission, Planning Director Castro noted that the
plans have appeared before the Commission on several occasions'within the last three
years, however, in previous plans the density has been more dense, and the County
property was included in the original plan, however the conceptual idea has not
changed. He advised that in the last action that the Commission took about a year
Arroyo Grande Planning Commission, 10 -21 -80 Page 3
ago they recommended the rezoning, of the property; plus the same conceptual plan.
The concerns of the City then were for both drainage and the circulation element.
The Council further requested that the developer identify and resolve those issues .
before the zoning could be considered. The predicament that the developer was
placed in was - how can he proceed with an expenditure of X number-.of dollars when
he doesn't know what he is looking at in terms of zoning. The Council, in their
action, denied the application, without prejudice, pending solution of.the drain-
age and circulation concerns. Commissioner Gerrish commented that, •what . has taken
place then, is that the Planning Commission has already approved the rezoning and
it was denied by the City Council.
Mitch Walker stated that the difference between this plan and the previous plan
was the past plan was accompanied by a major annexation. Chairman Gorsline com-
mented that the last plan considered by the Commission did not•include the annexa-
tion.
Chairman Gorsline advised he had originally voted on this and sent it on to
the City Council, realizing that something was going to have to be done about that
drainage and, since that time, that matter has been addressed. With regard to Com-
missioner Sebastian's comments about the densities,he stated he feels that in order
to have affordable housing in the City, we are going to have to go to higher den-
sities. However, he has become very concerned about the water and although this
maybe the policy of the City Council, he would have to look at it from a planning
point of view. He stated another concern that he has, and he hopes that the City
Council will address the matter, is that it makes it extremely difficult for the
Commission to vote on a zoning change of this magnitude, when we have no indication
whatsoever what the City Council's intentions•are on annexations. He stated he
would like to see some sort of annexation policy from the City Council.
Commissioner Gerrish stated, •.in,his.personal opinion, the issue before the Com-
mission is approval of the zone change. He agreed that the water question has to
be considered in that approval, but what Commissioner Sebastian is talking about
is establishing a policy relative to development within the City and he doesn't
think it is this Commission's function to establish policies of that nature. The
decision before the Commission tonight is - did these people solve the drainage
problem and the circulation problem that caused this plan to be disapproved in the
first place. Commissioner Cole stated she has always been opposed to cutting off
streets, and her main objection to this plan is the shutting off of Orchard Avenue
because, in her opinion, any project as big as this should have circulation to it.
Mr. Castro pointed out that there are 65.5 acres involved and the proposed den-
sity is less than the "R -1" District.
After further discussion by the Commission, the following action was taken:
RESOLUTION NO. 80 -776 Z
RESOLUTION OF THE CITY OF ARROYO GRANDE PLANNING
COMMISSION RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF AN AMENDMENT
TO THE MUNICIPAL CODE OF THE CITY OF ARROYO GRANDE
AS PROVIDED BY CHAPTER 4 ZONING, ARTICLE 32, OF
SAID CODE.
On motion by Commissioner Cole, seconded by Commissioner Gerrish, and by the
following roll call vote, to wit:
AYES:
NOES:
ABSENT:
Commissioners Cole and Gerrish
Commissioners Fischer, Pilkington, Sebastian and Chairman
Gorsline
Commissioner Moots
the foregoing Resolution was defeated this 21st day of October 1980.
Commissioner Gerrish stated with regard to Commissioner Sebastian's comments
about the water, he agrees that it is a problem andhe would like to see this
Commission either sit down and adopt a policy of their own, or recommend to the.
City Council that the City adopt a policy that specifically spells out what we are
going to do. He stated he doesn't know if the Commission would approach that with
a recommendation to the City Council or if the Commission should make a policy and
recommend it to them, or perhaps have a joint session with them. Commissioner
Sebastian stated he feels that City Engineer Karp has recommended some very viable
solutions in his report. He likes the concept about formulating a policy and, in
his opinion, one thing the Commission is aware of is that every annexation that has
been before the Council, whether denied or approved by this particular body, has
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Arroyo Grande Planning Commission, 10 -21 -80 Page 4
been approved by the Council and he feels that if anything is going to take place,
it' is going to require the Commission's initiative. He stated he likes the concept
about a policy regarding annexations and, in his opinion, we cannot afford at this
time to create any more annexations until we have complete control on our water
supply situation. Commissioner Gerrish stated he feels it is important to have a
policy on annexations and large'zone changes because, in his opinion, they are wast-
ing the developer's time and everyone else's time trying to answer the water'quest-
ion everytime a problem comes up. Chairman Gorsline stated he would' like to see a
joint session with the City Council that would help the Commission address the
matters of annexation, and specifically the concern of water. Commissioner Fischer
stated if a joint session is held, she would like•to see the Planning Commission
formulate policy and request that the Council concur with it.
Commissioner Sebastian suggested that further discussion of this matter be con-
tinued under "Communications ".
PUBLIC HEARING - VARIANCE CASE NO. 80 -70, REQUEST FOR 5 FT. SETBACK TO PERMIT RE-
LOCATION AND RENOVATION OF EXISTING BUILDING IN THE "C -B -D" DISTRICT, 132 BRIDGE
STREET (MC GILLIS, SAN LUIS ENGINEERING).
Planning Director Castro briefly the staff report, dated'October 17, •
1980. He advised that the Architectural Review Committee, after reviewing the
plot plan, concurred that the most critical concerns would be the driveway on to
Bridge Street, and was their opinion that the 12 ft. width was not sufficient.
To resolve the matter, itwill be necessary that the setback be reduced to 4 ft.
rather than 5 ft., and that the landscaped island adjoining the 12 ft. driveway
be eliminated to provide a minimum of a ft.'drive. Also, the recom=
mended that no eave overhang shall be permitted to project beyond the propert
line as currently noted the elevation plans. This recommendation would require
that the building be moved westerly and, in order to accommodate the 24 ft. backup
for parking stalls 5 through 8, that the landscape island between the building
and parking stall #2 be reduced accordingly to retain the 24 ft. backup.
Upon being assured by Planning Director Castro that Variance Case No. 80 -70 had
been duly published, posted and property owners notified, Chairman Gorsline de-
clared the hearing open.
Mr. Jim McGillis, Sunset Drive, petitioner for the Variance,•advised the Com-
mission that this Variance is being requested to clear up a circulation- problem.
There being no further comments for or against the proposed Variance, Chairman
Gorsline declared the hearing closed.
Commissioner Fischer stated, in her opinion; anything the Commission can do to
make sure that the is maintained and kept in use should be done, and she
is in favor of approving the request.
Planning Director Castro advised that in approving the Variance, the Commission
should make the following findings:
1. That the granting of the Variance is necessary to preserve the heritage
architecture of the building.
2. That the granting of said Variance will not adversely affect the adjoin-
ing property.
RESOLUTION NO. 80 -777 V
RESOLUTION OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION OF THE CITY
OF ARROYO GRANDE GRANTING A VARIANCE, CASE NO. 80 -70.
On motion by Commissioner Sebastian, seconded by Commissioner Gerrish,' and by
the following roll call vote, to wit:
AYES: Commissioners Cole, Fischer, Gerrish, Pilkington, Sebastian and
Chairman Gorsline._
NOES: None
ABSENT: Commissioner Moots. _
the following Resolution was adopted this 21st day of October'1980.
Arroyo Grande Planning Commission, 10 -21 -80 Page 5
PUBLIC HEARING - CONTINUATION.: REZONING CASE_NO. 80 -145, ZONE CHANGE FROM "RA -B3"
TO "RA -B2" DISTRICT, TALLY HO ROAD. (LA VINE). . •
Chairman • Gorsline announced that this matter -would be continued to the next
meeting pending re- advertisement of the zone change.
PUBLIC HEARING - REZONING CASE NO. 80 -146, ZONE CHANGE FROM "H -S" HIGHWAY SERVICE
DISTRICT TO "C -N" NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL DISTRICT, LOTS 1 AND 2, PARCEL MAP NO.
AG-79-840, TRACT #604, OAK PARK ACRES. (KOENIG & WOOD DEVELOPMENT C0.).
Planning Director Castro reviewed the staff report, dated October 17, 1980. He
advised that basically the request is to change the zoning on Lots 1 -and 2 from
the Highway Service District to the Neighborhood Commercial District. Also, the
developer has submitted a list of commercial uses anticipated for the development
in question. Mr. Castro advised that staff has no problems with the request as
submitted by the Oak Park development. The only stipulation he would suggest
that the Commission make, is that Parcel 6 will not develop as a neighborhood
shopping center. He recommended that the Commission schedule, under a Resolution
of Intention, another public hearing to discuss the potential use of Parcel 6.
Mr. John Koenig, 6615 East Pacific Coast Highway in Long Beach, stated they
have presented a tentative layout to show the way, in their opinion, some of the
uses could best be laid out, and it is a .preliminary design and is tentative at
best. He stated that the proposed uses are broad and is a representative list of
uses any one of which can be found in a shopping center over 10 to 12 acres.
Upon being assured by Planning Director Castro that public hearing for Rezoning
Case No. 80 -146 had been duly published, posted and property owners notified,
Chairman Gorsline declared the hearing open.
Bill Langworthy, Printz Road, stated that this is`:basically consistent for the
property and he has no real opposition with it. He stated he was concerned with
the "C -N" District on Oak Park Road being changed; as it has always been his feel-
ing that Lots 6 and 7 were what he considered to be the two weak spots in the plan,
and he would hope that some other more compatible use could be made of Lot 6.
Elizabeth Jackson, 208 Fair View Drive, stated the proposal looks more like a con-
venience center for shopping of people of Oak. Park Acres.
There being no further comments from the audience, Chairman Gorsline declared
the hearing closed.
In answer to Commissioner Fischer's question, Planning Director Castro advised
that the Commission should make known in their recommendation to the City Council
that Lot 6 should not be developed as a Neighborhood Shopping Center.
Commissioner Sebastian stated that when the Commission approved the lot line
adjustment, they talked very specifically to some aesthetic concerns, and Mr. Kvidt
came back with some presentations which were really very important in the Com-
mission's decision in changing the lot lines. Lou Caballero advised that the drain-
age hasn't changed, the slopes have not changed in terms of treatment, the dealing
of the high density development in relationship to the commercial development, how
the cross section is going to be treated has not changed; nothing has been changed
except that these people are taking over. There may be a little bit of changes in
how they are going to put buildings and shift .things around, which the Commission
will ultimately approve in any case. Commissioner Sebastian pointed out that one
of the Commission's concerns was dealing with the aesthetic impact of that big open
parking lot, and we were looking for the establishment of some larger trees in the
center that was a little more creative than the straight forward out-of- the -text-
book one.
After discussion,. the following action was taken:
RESOLUTION NO. 80 -778 Z
RESOLUTION OF THE CITY OF ARROYO GRANDE PLANNING
COMMISSION RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF AN AMENDMENT
TO THE MUNICIPAL CODE OF THE CITY OF ARROYO GRANDE
AS PROVIDED BY CHAPTER 4 ZONING, ARTICLE 32, OF
SAID CODE.
On motion by Commissioner Fischer, seconded by Commissioner Pilkington, and by
the following roll call vote, to wit:
AYES: Commissioners Cole, Fischer, Pilkington, Sebastian and Chairman
Gorsline
NOES: None
ABSENT: Commissioner Moots
ABSTAIN: Commissioner Gerrish
the foregoing Resolution was adopted this 21st day of October 1980.
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Arroyo Grande Planning Commission, 10 -21 -80 Page 6
Commissioner Fischer's motion was that Lots 1 and 2 of Tract 604 be rezoned
from the "H -S" District to the "C -N" District.. Further, that the tentative
list of commercial uses proposed by the Applicant shall be included in Ordinance
No. 140 C.S. for Lots 1 and 2• of Tract 604. Commissioner Fischer further noted
that the above recommendation stipulates that should the Council concur with the
proposed zone change, the Council express a with the Commission's
Resolution of Intention to rezone Lot 6 of Tract 604 from the "C -N" District to
the "H-S"- District, or such other district as deemed desirable by the Planning
Commission to retain the integrity of "the previously approved commercial plans
for Oak Park Acres recognizing only one Neighborhood Commercial center.
After further discussion, the following action was taken:
RESOLUTION NO. 80 -779
RESOLUTION OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION OF THE '
CITY OF ARROYO GRANDE EXPRESSING INTENTION TO
INITIATE A ZONE CHANGE.
On motion by Commissioner Fischer, seconded by Commissioner Pilkington, and
by the following roll call vote, to wit: _
AYES: Commissioners Cole, Fischer, Gerrish, Pilkington, Sebastian and
Chairman Gorsline
NOES: None
ABSENT: Commissioner Moots
the foregoing Resolution was adopted this 21st day of October 1980.
REVIEW - USE PERMIT CASE NO. 79 -387, FREE STANDING SIGNS FOR MINI STORAGE
FACILITY IN THE "P -M" DISTRICT, 1204 POPLAR STREET. (GRANT).
Planning Director Castro advised that in the granting of the original Use
Permit, the Commission approved the signs for one year, with further review at
that time. He stated that staff sees no problem with the signs and would recom-
mend granting approval for an additional year.
After a brief discussion, on motion by Commissioner Cole, seconded by Commis-
sioner Sebastian, and unanimously carried, a one year's extension was granted for
signs approved under Use Permit Case No. 79 -287.
REFERRAL FROM CITY COUNCIL - REVIEW OF REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION BY ERVIN ENGINEER-
ING 15 ACRES ADJACENT TO GOLDEN WEST AND SUNRISE TERRACE.
Planning Director Castro referred to a map describing the property in question.
He stated he, personally, doesn't see any problem in straightening the city limit
boundary lines, but there is some concern regarding the circulation and perhaps
some of the uses that the applicant may be looking at. He stated he would like
some preliminary indications from them on those two issues before any action can
be taken. Mr. Castro recommended that the applicant submit some kind of . a cir-
culation /land use plan so the matter can be brought back to the Commission for
consideration.
After a brief discussion, on motion by Commissioner Sebastian, seconded by Com-
missioner Gerrish, and unanimously carried, request for annexation by Ervin Engin-
eering was continued until after the Commission's study session and some sort of
policy formed for recommendation to the City Council; also, that applicant submit
a preliminary circulation /land use plan for consideration.
REVIEW PROPOSED ORDINANCE - CULTURAL HERITAGE COMMISSION
Planning Director Castro advised that since this is the first time the Commis-
sion has seen the ordinance, he recommended that the matter be taken under advise-
ment and a public hearing scheduled for the November 4th meeting. The Commission
was in agreement with staff's recommendation to schedule a public hearing for
November 4, 1980.
REVISED PARKING AND DRAINAGE PLAN - SHOPPING CENTER AT COURTLAND AND GRAND AVE.
Planning Director Castro advised that the City Engineer's recommendation was
that due to the inability to enlarge the ponding at the Sports Complex, many of
these properties will now be required to do their own ponding areas. Mr. Castro
stated that what he had told Mr. Gerrish and his designers was to go back and re-
design something that would be in agreement with the City Engineer's recommenda-
tions. He further stated that the redesign will affect the parking scheme that
was planned in front, however, he didn't believe that the amount of parking being
reduced would be significant enough that it would affect the shopping center. He
stated that the development plan is still the same, so nothing will change except
the area here will be designated as a retention pond until such time as they can
take the water south to the ponding area.
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Arroyo Grande Planning Commission, 10 -21 -80 Page 7
After a brief discussion, on motion by Commissioner Fischer, seconded by
Commissioner'Pilkington, motion carried with'one abstention, the revised park-
ing, ponding and drainage plans for the Central Coast Shopping Center at
Courtland and Grand was approved.
ORAL COMMUNICATIONS
After further discussion regarding the suggested study session regarding a
annexation /water policy, Commissioner Sebastian recommended incorporating the
matter as an agenda item for the next meeting. Planning Director Castro sug
gested that the Commission take the City Engineer's .recommendations and perhaps
develop their own thoughts in terms of how they wish to address the concerns in
regard to growth, water, etc.
The Commission was in agreement that the added as an item on the
next Commission agenda.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the Commission, the meeting was ad-
journed 10 :30 P.M. by the Chairman. •
ATTEST: /. (J .
Secretary
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